May I sell a novel written with the 'non-commercial' Word?

It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell this, you
fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has nothing
that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf , open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know, does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license mentions
'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a movie studio's
machine, that would be clear, but what about freelancers?

--RBlan

Hi RBlan,

I am not sure but i think YOU CAN'T

See this knowledge based article from Microsoft:

The title bar displays "non-commercial use" when you start an Office Home
and Student 2007 program
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/937676

Again, I am not fully aware about this Microsoft policy. Better, you can
call on 1-800-936-5700 (toll free) i.e. Microsoft Word Support number and get
confirmation from Microsoft regarding the same.

--
Regards,
Anup


"RBlan" wrote:

It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell this, you
fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has nothing
that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf , open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know, does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license mentions
'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a movie studio's
machine, that would be clear, but what about freelancers?

--RBlan

When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that it would
not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if you're freelance or
not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work for a non-profit
oprganization.

--

JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"


"RBlan" wrote in message
...
It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the Home
and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell this, you
fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product information when
I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has nothing
that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf , open in Wordpad
and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know, does
NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license mentions
'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a movie studio's
machine, that would be clear, but what about freelancers?

--RBlan

Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could put the
program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to educationalists.
It could be argued that education is a 'commercial' endeavour. I wonder too
to what extent purchasers of the software are aware of the limitations
imposed when they pay their money for the product i.e. before they get as
far as being able to read the EULA? And if they did not agree, could they
then get their money back on the basis that it cannot be used for a
legitimate home user task, that may later have a commercial application e.g.
writing a novel?

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




JoAnn Paules wrote:
When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that it
would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if you're
freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work for a
non-profit oprganization.


"RBlan" wrote in message
...
It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
freelancers? --RBlan

The EULA says that if you don't agree to it, stop and return the software.

"BY USING THE SOFTWARE, YOU ACCEPT THESE TERMS. IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT THEM,
DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN IT TO THE RETAILER FOR A REFUND OR
CREDIT.
If you cannot obtain a refund there, contact Microsoft or the Microsoft
affiliate serving your country for information about Microsoft's refund
policies.
See www.microsoft.com/worldwide. In the United States and Canada, call (800)
MICROSOFT or see www.microsoft.com/info/nareturns.htm."



--

JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"


"Graham Mayor" wrote in message
...
Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could put
the program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to
educationalists. It could be argued that education is a 'commercial'
endeavour. I wonder too to what extent purchasers of the software are
aware of the limitations imposed when they pay their money for the product
i.e. before they get as far as being able to read the EULA? And if they
did not agree, could they then get their money back on the basis that it
cannot be used for a legitimate home user task, that may later have a
commercial application e.g. writing a novel?

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




JoAnn Paules wrote:
When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that it
would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if you're
freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work for a
non-profit oprganization.


"RBlan" wrote in message
...
It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
freelancers? --RBlan

And, yet, I've yet to see a retailer who will accept return of opened
software ;-)

Tom

"JoAnn Paules" wrote in message
...
: The EULA says that if you don't agree to it, stop and return the software.
:
: "BY USING THE SOFTWARE, YOU ACCEPT THESE TERMS. IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT THEM,
: DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN IT TO THE RETAILER FOR A REFUND
OR
: CREDIT.
: If you cannot obtain a refund there, contact Microsoft or the Microsoft
: affiliate serving your country for information about Microsoft's refund
: policies.
: See www.microsoft.com/worldwide. In the United States and Canada, call
(800)
: MICROSOFT or see www.microsoft.com/info/nareturns.htm."
:
:
:
: --
:
: JoAnn Paules
: MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
: Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"
:
:
: "Graham Mayor" wrote in message
: ...
: Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could put
: the program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to
: educationalists. It could be argued that education is a 'commercial'
: endeavour. I wonder too to what extent purchasers of the software are
: aware of the limitations imposed when they pay their money for the
product
: i.e. before they get as far as being able to read the EULA? And if they
: did not agree, could they then get their money back on the basis that it
: cannot be used for a legitimate home user task, that may later have a
: commercial application e.g. writing a novel?
:
: --
:
: Graham Mayor - Word MVP
:
: My web site www.gmayor.com
: Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org
:
:
:
:
: JoAnn Paules wrote:
: When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that it
: would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if you're
: freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work for a
: non-profit oprganization.
:
:
: "RBlan" wrote in message
: ...
: It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
: Home and
: Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
: this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
: information when I
: was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
: edition.
:
: I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
: nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
: open in Wordpad and
: then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
: does NOT
: prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
: mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
: movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
: freelancers? --RBlan
:
:
:
:

OK thanks - but I still think you might be hard pressed to find a legitimate
use for the software given the wide ranging exclusions..

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org



JoAnn Paules wrote:
The EULA says that if you don't agree to it, stop and return the
software.
"BY USING THE SOFTWARE, YOU ACCEPT THESE TERMS. IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT
THEM, DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN IT TO THE RETAILER FOR
A REFUND OR CREDIT.
If you cannot obtain a refund there, contact Microsoft or the
Microsoft affiliate serving your country for information about
Microsoft's refund policies.
See www.microsoft.com/worldwide. In the United States and Canada,
call (800) MICROSOFT or see www.microsoft.com/info/nareturns.htm."




"Graham Mayor" wrote in message
...
Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could
put the program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to
educationalists. It could be argued that education is a 'commercial'
endeavour. I wonder too to what extent purchasers of the software are
aware of the limitations imposed when they pay their money for the
product i.e. before they get as far as being able to read the EULA?
And if they did not agree, could they then get their money back on
the basis that it cannot be used for a legitimate home user task,
that may later have a commercial application e.g. writing a novel?

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




JoAnn Paules wrote:
When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that
it would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if
you're freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work
for a non-profit oprganization.


"RBlan" wrote in message
...
It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the
'Enterprise" edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
freelancers? --RBlan

Homework, family newsletters, family budgets, home inventories, family
medical records

(Not arguing the point, just listing legitimate uses)

--

JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"



"Graham Mayor" wrote in message
...
OK thanks - but I still think you might be hard pressed to find a
legitimate use for the software given the wide ranging exclusions..

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org



JoAnn Paules wrote:
The EULA says that if you don't agree to it, stop and return the
software.
"BY USING THE SOFTWARE, YOU ACCEPT THESE TERMS. IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT
THEM, DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN IT TO THE RETAILER FOR
A REFUND OR CREDIT.
If you cannot obtain a refund there, contact Microsoft or the
Microsoft affiliate serving your country for information about
Microsoft's refund policies.
See www.microsoft.com/worldwide. In the United States and Canada,
call (800) MICROSOFT or see www.microsoft.com/info/nareturns.htm."




"Graham Mayor" wrote in message
...
Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could
put the program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to
educationalists. It could be argued that education is a 'commercial'
endeavour. I wonder too to what extent purchasers of the software are
aware of the limitations imposed when they pay their money for the
product i.e. before they get as far as being able to read the EULA?
And if they did not agree, could they then get their money back on
the basis that it cannot be used for a legitimate home user task,
that may later have a commercial application e.g. writing a novel?

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




JoAnn Paules wrote:
When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that
it would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if
you're freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work
for a non-profit oprganization.


"RBlan" wrote in message
...
It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the
'Enterprise" edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
freelancers? --RBlan

Me either but at least Microsoft gives you an alternative.

--

JoAnn Paules
MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"



"Tom [Pepper] Willett" wrote in message
...
And, yet, I've yet to see a retailer who will accept return of opened
software ;-)

Tom

"JoAnn Paules" wrote in message
...
: The EULA says that if you don't agree to it, stop and return the
software.
:
: "BY USING THE SOFTWARE, YOU ACCEPT THESE TERMS. IF YOU DO NOT ACCEPT
THEM,
: DO NOT USE THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN IT TO THE RETAILER FOR A REFUND
OR
: CREDIT.
: If you cannot obtain a refund there, contact Microsoft or the Microsoft
: affiliate serving your country for information about Microsoft's refund
: policies.
: See www.microsoft.com/worldwide. In the United States and Canada, call
(800)
: MICROSOFT or see www.microsoft.com/info/nareturns.htm."
:
:
:
: --
:
: JoAnn Paules
: MVP Microsoft [Publisher]
: Tech Editor for "Microsoft Publisher 2007 For Dummies"
:
:
: "Graham Mayor" wrote in message
: ...
: Hmmm. On that basis, it is difficult to see what legal use you could
put
: the program to. The application is, for example, widely sold to
: educationalists. It could be argued that education is a 'commercial'
: endeavour. I wonder too to what extent purchasers of the software are
: aware of the limitations imposed when they pay their money for the
product
: i.e. before they get as far as being able to read the EULA? And if
they
: did not agree, could they then get their money back on the basis that
it
: cannot be used for a legitimate home user task, that may later have a
: commercial application e.g. writing a novel?
:
: --
:
: Graham Mayor - Word MVP
:
: My web site www.gmayor.com
: Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org
:
:
:
:
: JoAnn Paules wrote:
: When you installed the Home and Student version, *you agreed* that it
: would not be used for commercial endeavors. Doesn't matter if you're
: freelance or not. You can't even use it to do volunteer work for a
: non-profit oprganization.
:
:
: "RBlan" wrote in message
: ...
: It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the
: Home and
: Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell
: this, you fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product
: information when I
: was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the
'Enterprise"
: edition.
:
: I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has
: nothing that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf ,
: open in Wordpad and
: then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know,
: does NOT
: prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license
: mentions 'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a
: movie studio's machine, that would be clear, but what about
: freelancers? --RBlan
:
:
:
:

Thanks for the input. I called MS (thanks for the number, Anup Tawde) and
after bullying my way up to a supervisor (the first rep said "of course you
can sell it, you own your own creations") I got the answer from the honchos
at Sales and Licensing who confirmed Joanne Paules first judgment:
PROHIBBITED.

Naturally, this irritates me. For the sake of the argument, let's say I
write a novel (for my own amusement) in Word Home and Student. I finish it
and, just to be safe from future software incompatibilities (such as going
from .doc to .docx), I decide to save my work as an .rtf file. A year later,
after I've scrapped my Vista Ultimate machine for a Mac, I open the old .rtf
file and say to myself, "Hey, this is pretty good -- I think I'll try to sell
it." No way, right? Microsoft owns me. If I'm honest about it the courts will
grant Microsoft at least half the revenue from this sale, for I shamefully
breeched a contract that couldn't be clearer: "The software is not licensed
for use in any commercial, non-profit, or revenue-generating business
activities." Trying to sell a novel is clearly a "business activity" so even
if it doesn't sell, or if I self-publish and it bombs, i.e. it was a
'non-profit' venture after all, I'm in violation of the license, and I owe MS
whatever the lawyers can squeeze out of me. Of course if I'm dishonest about
it, whoTF is going to know about it? Honesty is the best policy, of course.

I called Hewlett Packard, from whom I bought the software along with a $3000
state of the art computer to replace my Win98SE system and said, "I want to
return this software -- the license terms are unacceptable to me." Sargi
consulted with her supervisors and reported that they could not accept
returns of software sold with a computer system. Blessedly, HP has a 30-day
system return policy. "Okay, I said, if you won't take the software back, I'm
returning the whole system." More consultation: "We can't take the software
back but we'll refund you $80." "How much did I pay for this software?"
"$149" ($.99 short, but close enough.) "That's not acceptable -- I'm
returning everything." More consultation. "$100." "Not acceptable, -- I'm
returning everything." More consultation. (You know, I miss my Firefox spell
checker -- I think I'll switch back after I finish writing this.) They fold.
I'm getting the $149 and they can keep the change. And I still own (I mean,
license) this crippleware, but soon it will be in the trash. No part of my
novel will be written in Home and Student. However I did irresponsibly open
my primary file of notes for my novel in this software (though I only read,
did not write), so technically, I have used Home and Student for commercial
purposes, and I was in violaton of the license terms. I admit this freely and
I invite Microsoft to send me the bill for damages -- no need to get into
messy legal proceedings.

I almost paid HP $399 for Office 2007 Standard but at the last minute I
said "I changed my mind, I'll buy it from a software discounter. I didn't.
To make a long story short(er), I found out that my old Word 2000 from the
Win98 machine was elegible to upgrade to Word (not Office, mercifully) 2007
for $109.00 list (See e.g.
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Word...dp/B000HCVR5S).
Don't you just love a happy ending?

By the way, MS wanted to charge me $79? (I forget the exact amount) to
answer my question as to whether Word 2007 Standard would run on my 64-bit
system since the system requirements say "32 bit browser only". They said to
ask HP since I bought the OEM Vista Ultimate. Of course the crack staff at HP
didn't really know either but suggested that since Home & Student ran on my
machine, I should have no problem. Wouldn't it be funny if it didn't work
after all?

--Ralph

"RBlan" wrote:

It really irritates me to see that "not-commercial use" line on the Home and
Student version title bar -- it almost says "you'll never sell this, you
fool!" This restriction was not mentioned on the product information when I
was selecting this software. I certainly didn't need the 'Enterprise"
edition.

I suppose that since a novel or even a screenplay manuscript has nothing
that can't be done in .rtf that one could save as .rtf , open in Wordpad and
then save again and/or print from a program that, as far as I know, does NOT
prohibit 'comercial use'. This really irritates me. The license mentions
'business' use, and if I were writing a screenplay on a movie studio's
machine, that would be clear, but what about freelancers?

--RBlan