Word07 Outline won't properly number

This is the fourth time I have tried to ask this question in
'word.general.questions' but it never make it to the list. I am not sure if
there are intermediaries involved or technical problems. And yes, I am
waiting many hours between posts.

Like many of you, I am frustrated, disappointed, even angry at how
complicated and counterintuitive the use of outlines is in Word07. I am not
looking to create a complicated environment in which different 'levels' are
connected to very different formats. I simply want to create outlines in
which
(1.) it is easy to move elements around (to promote or demote, to move up
or down),
(2.) in which elements can be expanded or collapsed,
(3.) all with a coherent numbering scheme.

This is easy in OneNote07 where it is the default. I finally managed this
long ago in WordXP, but not without hard wiring my 'headings' so that only
one system was acceptable. Still I did it, having to "program" WordXP to even
get it to produce the most basic outlines. While I have had Word07 for over a
year I still cannot get it to produce even the most basic outline.

I should point out that if one uses the "help" of Word 07, and ask how to
create an multilevel outline, I am forwarded to how to create multilevel
numbered lists, lists which don't have the ability to expand and collapse
lower levels. This seems a flaw. When I search around further, I am
forwarded to websites that explain outlines for earlier versions of Word
(where the link between levels was clearer).

So here's the problem more simply:

Suppose I want to create a simple 1/a/1/a/ outline. I go to the outline tab
at the bottom of any page. I type something in the blank codument and assume
that Word 07 will believe I am at 'Level I.' It is unclear because, of
course, I have to go back to the Home tab on the ribbon in order to see what
style is being used, such as 'Heading 1'. I then go to the paragraph subset
of the home tab and choose multilevel outline. I see the "define new
multilevel list' option which gives some indication of what level I'm at.'

I see 1.) appear at the beginning of the first line. I hit return, see the
second element with its 2.) appear. I now demote that elements using the
shortcut shft-alt-right arrow, expecting it to turn into 'a.)' (I could use
the arrow). But while the heading on the styles above does shift to 'Heading
2,' the number sequence does not change! So I end up with outlines that look
proceed serially not like a multilevel list
1.
2.
3.
4.

If the links between the levels and the headings are broken, why is it so
hard to find any information on the Microsoft websites to fix this? Again, I
have followed other information that the Microsoft website has provided since
I simply want to begin with the "format" of each level to be the same - I
don't want blue fonts, bold or italics, changes in the space between
paragraph elements, etc. I simply want a simple outline, but with more
functionality than a numbered list (eg. including ability to expand and
collapse). In the future I might decide at some level might be bold or not.

For the record, using 'modify style,' these are the styles of the headings:

Heading 1 : Font: (Asian) +Headings Asian, (Default) Calibri, 12 pt,
Justified, Line spacing: Multiple 1.15 li, Widow/Orphan control, Keep with
next, Keep lines together, Level 1, Style: Linked, Quick Style, Priority: 10,
Following style: Normal

Heading2: Level 2, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 1, Following style: Normal

Heading3: Level 3, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 2, Following style: Normal

Etc. (I don't know anything about this Asian heading). So is there any hope
of creating even the most basic outline which will look something like:
1.
a.
b.
2.

I hope this gets through (and FYI, I am using the Vista64 OS). As a College
Prof. who has also taught writing, I would love to have a straightforward way
to explain how to create outlines in Word for college level students. At
this point, I'm sure they're ready to jump to OpenOffice or some other
competitor. I have told them that outlines are very useful for writing
documents, but I can not longer produce them in MS-Word 2007. G.

I have seen at least one previous post from you with identical content and
replied to it, but you may find it easier to find the messages you have
posted if you post in the Numbering newsgroup, which has much lower traffic.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...
This is the fourth time I have tried to ask this question in
'word.general.questions' but it never make it to the list. I am not sure
if
there are intermediaries involved or technical problems. And yes, I am
waiting many hours between posts.

Like many of you, I am frustrated, disappointed, even angry at how
complicated and counterintuitive the use of outlines is in Word07. I am
not
looking to create a complicated environment in which different 'levels'
are
connected to very different formats. I simply want to create outlines in
which
(1.) it is easy to move elements around (to promote or demote, to move up
or down),
(2.) in which elements can be expanded or collapsed,
(3.) all with a coherent numbering scheme.

This is easy in OneNote07 where it is the default. I finally managed this
long ago in WordXP, but not without hard wiring my 'headings' so that only
one system was acceptable. Still I did it, having to "program" WordXP to
even
get it to produce the most basic outlines. While I have had Word07 for
over a
year I still cannot get it to produce even the most basic outline.

I should point out that if one uses the "help" of Word 07, and ask how to
create an multilevel outline, I am forwarded to how to create multilevel
numbered lists, lists which don't have the ability to expand and collapse
lower levels. This seems a flaw. When I search around further, I am
forwarded to websites that explain outlines for earlier versions of Word
(where the link between levels was clearer).

So here's the problem more simply:

Suppose I want to create a simple 1/a/1/a/ outline. I go to the outline
tab
at the bottom of any page. I type something in the blank codument and
assume
that Word 07 will believe I am at 'Level I.' It is unclear because, of
course, I have to go back to the Home tab on the ribbon in order to see
what
style is being used, such as 'Heading 1'. I then go to the paragraph
subset
of the home tab and choose multilevel outline. I see the "define new
multilevel list' option which gives some indication of what level I'm at.'

I see 1.) appear at the beginning of the first line. I hit return, see the
second element with its 2.) appear. I now demote that elements using the
shortcut shft-alt-right arrow, expecting it to turn into 'a.)' (I could
use
the arrow). But while the heading on the styles above does shift to
'Heading
2,' the number sequence does not change! So I end up with outlines that
look
proceed serially not like a multilevel list
1.
2.
3.
4.

If the links between the levels and the headings are broken, why is it so
hard to find any information on the Microsoft websites to fix this? Again,
I
have followed other information that the Microsoft website has provided
since
I simply want to begin with the "format" of each level to be the same - I
don't want blue fonts, bold or italics, changes in the space between
paragraph elements, etc. I simply want a simple outline, but with more
functionality than a numbered list (eg. including ability to expand and
collapse). In the future I might decide at some level might be bold or
not.

For the record, using 'modify style,' these are the styles of the
headings:

Heading 1 : Font: (Asian) +Headings Asian, (Default) Calibri, 12 pt,
Justified, Line spacing: Multiple 1.15 li, Widow/Orphan control, Keep
with
next, Keep lines together, Level 1, Style: Linked, Quick Style, Priority:
10,
Following style: Normal

Heading2: Level 2, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 1, Following style: Normal

Heading3: Level 3, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 2, Following style: Normal

Etc. (I don't know anything about this Asian heading). So is there any
hope
of creating even the most basic outline which will look something like:
1.
a.
b.
2.

I hope this gets through (and FYI, I am using the Vista64 OS). As a
College
Prof. who has also taught writing, I would love to have a straightforward
way
to explain how to create outlines in Word for college level students. At
this point, I'm sure they're ready to jump to OpenOffice or some other
competitor. I have told them that outlines are very useful for writing
documents, but I can not longer produce them in MS-Word 2007. G.

Well, I am glad my post finally made it to the list. Perhaps the repeated
non-sends had to do with the way I was closing my submissions (this time I
used 'close' inside of Internet Explorer, rather than just 'post'). And yes,
I can now see that the USENET Vehicle for
microsoft.public.word.docmanagement. That is not clear from the official
Microsoft website that brought me here.

I hope it is clear that I want to create a "multilevel outline" and *not* a
"multilevel list". Period.

Yes, I can see the multilevel *list* tab with such options as, 'define new
list style' and 'define new multilevel list.' However, no matter what indent
or numbering scheme is used and meant to show up in the print layout, every
line in the list is set as "body text". This fact (appears to) offer no
functionality to *expand* or *collapse* sub-elements.

Whil to add this functionality, eone must invest a serious amount of time
on resetting the 'heading sty'es.' I am making some headway on programming
each 'heading style', I still don't see the way to link level, so that one
would get:
1.
1.1
1.2
1.2.1
2.

One can go to the strip/home/styles/heading 1/[right-click]/modify
style/format tab/numbering and bullets/define new number format... but there
no longer seems to be a link between levels as there was in Word 2003 when
you try to redefine 'Heading 2'

Again, I think it is a mistake that when I search on "multi-level outline"
on the official Microsoft Office website I am sent to Multilevel list."
Shauna Kelly's tutorial does not appear to be updated for 2007 despite what
it says at the bottom.

I think a single clear explanation of how to create ewould prove useful

Well, I am glad my post finally made it to the list. Perhaps the repeated
non-sends had to do with the way I was closing my submissions (this time I
used 'close' inside of Internet Explorer, rather than just 'post'). And yes,
I can now see that the USENET Vehicle for
microsoft.public.word.docmanagement. That is not clear from the official
Microsoft website that brought me here.

I hope it is clear that I want to create a "multilevel outline" and *not* a
"multilevel list". Period.

Yes, I can see the multilevel *list* tab with such options as, 'define new
list style' and 'define new multilevel list.' However, no matter what indent
or numbering scheme is used and meant to show up in the print layout, every
line in the list is set as "body text". This fact (appears to) offer no
functionality to *expand* or *collapse* sub-elements.

Whil to add this functionality, eone must invest a serious amount of time
on resetting the 'heading sty'es.' I am making some headway on programming
each 'heading style', I still don't see the way to link level, so that one
would get:
1.
1.1
1.2
1.2.1
2.

One can go to the strip/home/styles/heading 1/[right-click]/modify
style/format tab/numbering and bullets/define new number format... but there
no longer seems to be a link between levels as there was in Word 2003 when
you try to redefine 'Heading 2'

Again, I think it is a mistake that when I search on "multi-level outline"
on the official Microsoft Office website I am sent to Multilevel list."
Shauna Kelly's tutorial does not appear to be updated for 2007 despite what
it says at the bottom.

I think a single clear explanation of how to create a interconnected,
expandable/collapseable outline would prove useful to the list.

Click on the Multilevel list button and then on the illustration that shows
1, 1.1, 1.1.1 linked to Heading 1, Heading 2, Heading 3, etc. *Then* click
Define New Multilevel List, which will open the dialog with that list
template selected. From there, the Define New Multilevel List dialog is more
or less identical to the Customize Outline-Numbered List dialog in Word
2003, although arranged a little differently. Click More to expand the
dialog, and you will see that the levels are linked to the built-in heading
styles by default.

If you use an NNTP newsreader such as Outlook Express or Windows Live Mail
to read these newsgroups in Usenet, you'll doubtless find posting (and
finding your posts) much easier. See http://www.gmayor.com/MSNews.htm

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...
Well, I am glad my post finally made it to the list. Perhaps the repeated
non-sends had to do with the way I was closing my submissions (this time I
used 'close' inside of Internet Explorer, rather than just 'post'). And
yes,
I can now see that the USENET Vehicle for
microsoft.public.word.docmanagement. That is not clear from the official
Microsoft website that brought me here.

I hope it is clear that I want to create a "multilevel outline" and *not*
a
"multilevel list". Period.

Yes, I can see the multilevel *list* tab with such options as, 'define new
list style' and 'define new multilevel list.' However, no matter what
indent
or numbering scheme is used and meant to show up in the print layout,
every
line in the list is set as "body text". This fact (appears to) offer no
functionality to *expand* or *collapse* sub-elements.

Whil to add this functionality, eone must invest a serious amount of time
on resetting the 'heading sty'es.' I am making some headway on
programming
each 'heading style', I still don't see the way to link level, so that one
would get:
1.
1.1
1.2
1.2.1
2.

One can go to the strip/home/styles/heading 1/[right-click]/modify
style/format tab/numbering and bullets/define new number format... but
there
no longer seems to be a link between levels as there was in Word 2003 when
you try to redefine 'Heading 2'

Again, I think it is a mistake that when I search on "multi-level outline"
on the official Microsoft Office website I am sent to Multilevel list."
Shauna Kelly's tutorial does not appear to be updated for 2007 despite
what
it says at the bottom.

I think a single clear explanation of how to create ewould prove useful

I can't tell if my messages are going through. When I tried to post I get
the following error message:
The website is too busy to show the webpage HTTP 408/HTTP 409. What you can try: Refresh the page. / Go back to the previous page. / More information. This error (HTTP 408 Request Timeout or HTTP 409 Conflict) means that the server took too long to display the page or there were too many people requesting the same webpage. / For more information about HTTP errors, see Help.

Originally I thought this meant that the posting had gone through, but that
the site update would take time because there was too much traffic. But then
I let an hour go by and I still don't see the posting, I don't see that
Microsoft has a discussion group about the problems with their own Microsoft
office on line discussion group software. But then that would recursively a
problem since how do you post about a posting problem.

Original Response.
"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:
If you use an NNTP newsreader such as Outlook Express or Windows Live Mail
to read these newsgroups in Usenet, you'll doubtless find posting (and
finding your posts) much easier. See http://www.gmayor.com/MSNews.htm

I really don't know much about Outlook Express or anything about Windows
Live Mail. Because of compatibility issues with my telephone and
office/academic software, I finally migrated to Outlook 07 about a year ago.
I know that Outlook Express evolved from a newsreader of some sort and was
promoted as the free version of Outlook. However, back in the 1980s when
USENET was one of the few common, open, global bulletin board systems I
simply used the free version of Agent to access discussions and compile
binaries (since unix tn etc had interface challenges). That is why I am
still sensitive to the fact that USENET is independent of the Web. That
said, I am simply trying to come to the Microsoft website to get answers for
what I think should be a relatively basic problem for their Microsoft Word
07. They are the ones who forwarded me to this Microsoft office online
discussion group system. I can still find no evidence of any other 'recent'
submissions on outlines, so I thank you for:
1. Responding and
2. Returning to this thread to respond.
If you don't like my inability to find other threads, then you should take
it up with Microsoft.

Click on the Multilevel list button and then on the illustration that shows
1, 1.1, 1.1.1 linked to Heading 1, Heading 2, Heading 3, etc. *Then* click
Define New Multilevel List, which will open the dialog with that list
template selected. From there, the Define New Multilevel List dialog is more
or less identical to the Customize Outline-Numbered List dialog in Word
2003, although arranged a little differently. Click More to expand the
dialog, and you will see that the levels are linked to the built-in heading
styles by default.

This did not work.

The multilevel list dialogue seems to be associated with normal textual work
and not outlines. Moving elements around with the whole window open
immediately broke any connection that a 1/1.1/1.1.1/ numbering system might
have with an outline. Shifting to the outline view ribbon tab revealed that
once again Word seem to be creating a multilevel list as opposed to a
multilevel outline, with things working out of body text. No ability to
expand or contract sub elements.

And of course in the outline view one cannot see which headings one is using
ahead of time, unless I guess one customizes the ribbon in some way. Is that
what I need to tell college students to do? I am still not sure why creation
of an numbering scheme for the outline would not be on the outline part of
the ribbon.

Returning to the general home ribbon: multilevel list / list and current
document is 1/1.1/1.1.1... / define a new multilevel list.. and the expanded
dialogue reveals
apply changes to - the whole list,
link level to style - no style,
level to show in gallery - level I,
ListNum field list name - nothing
And down below their various alignment issues and ways to link one level to
the other as you change which level to modify.

If I am in the ordinary print view, there is no sort of indentation that one
might associate with an outline. And if you shift to outline view, all the
connections appear broken. For example, if I use the right arrow to shift to
level III, there is no numbering scheme at all, no 1.1.1. Just text,
although with a plus or minus in a gray circle to indicate that I'm using
outline elements.

In the outline view, if I right-click on something that is at "level III"
the resulting dialogue suggests that there is no numbering scheme, and the
only thing that I am allowed to put in is a number or letter, nothing to do
with a multilevel scheme anymore. And if I go back to the home ribbon,
multilevel list, it still says that I am using 1/1.1/1.1.1... numbering
scheme, but the none is now highlighted.

This is not like Word 2003. This is very different. Thanks.


--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...
Well, I am glad my post finally made it to the list. Perhaps the repeated
non-sends had to do with the way I was closing my submissions (this time I
used 'close' inside of Internet Explorer, rather than just 'post'). And
yes,
I can now see that the USENET Vehicle for
microsoft.public.word.docmanagement. That is not clear from the official
Microsoft website that brought me here.

I hope it is clear that I want to create a "multilevel outline" and *not*
a
"multilevel list". Period.

Yes, I can see the multilevel *list* tab with such options as, 'define new
list style' and 'define new multilevel list.' However, no matter what
indent
or numbering scheme is used and meant to show up in the print layout,
every
line in the list is set as "body text". This fact (appears to) offer no
functionality to *expand* or *collapse* sub-elements.

Whil to add this functionality, eone must invest a serious amount of time
on resetting the 'heading sty'es.' I am making some headway on
programming
each 'heading style', I still don't see the way to link level, so that one
would get:
1.
1.1
1.2
1.2.1
2.

One can go to the strip/home/styles/heading 1/[right-click]/modify
style/format tab/numbering and bullets/define new number format... but
there
no longer seems to be a link between levels as there was in Word 2003 when
you try to redefine 'Heading 2'

Again, I think it is a mistake that when I search on "multi-level outline"
on the official Microsoft Office website I am sent to Multilevel list."
Shauna Kelly's tutorial does not appear to be updated for 2007 despite
what
it says at the bottom.

I think a single clear explanation of how to create ewould prove useful


.

If you apply the 1, 1.1, 1.1.1 numbering to the built-in heading styles,
then the heading styles will be numbered as you prefer (including indents).
Keep in mind that it is still necessary to do this all at once for all the
styles, starting from the first Heading 1 in the document (see
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numb...Numbering.html for general
principles). You can then apply the heading styles to achieve the desired
outline and Promote/Demote as desired.

There's no reason you can't still use Free Agent to access these NGs; just
configure it to access the msnews.microsoft.com server. If you are more
comfortable with an NNTP newsreader, I would highly recommend it. You will
see the same NGs you see here (the Web page is just a front end to Usenet).
I mentioned Outlook Express and Windows Live Mail because they are readily
available to Windows/Internet Explorer users. OE was not designed as a "free
version of Outlook"; Outlook is not a newsreader, whereas OE is both a mail
client and a newsreader. It is possible to set Outlook up to use OE as its
newsreader.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...

I can't tell if my messages are going through. When I tried to post I get
the following error message:
The website is too busy to show the webpage HTTP 408/HTTP 409. What you
can try: Refresh the page. / Go back to the previous page. / More
information. This error (HTTP 408 Request Timeout or HTTP 409 Conflict)
means that the server took too long to display the page or there were
too many people requesting the same webpage. / For more information
about HTTP errors, see Help.

Originally I thought this meant that the posting had gone through, but
that
the site update would take time because there was too much traffic. But
then
I let an hour go by and I still don't see the posting, I don't see that
Microsoft has a discussion group about the problems with their own
Microsoft
office on line discussion group software. But then that would recursively
a
problem since how do you post about a posting problem.

Original Response.
"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:
If you use an NNTP newsreader such as Outlook Express or Windows Live
Mail
to read these newsgroups in Usenet, you'll doubtless find posting (and
finding your posts) much easier. See http://www.gmayor.com/MSNews.htm

I really don't know much about Outlook Express or anything about Windows
Live Mail. Because of compatibility issues with my telephone and
office/academic software, I finally migrated to Outlook 07 about a year
ago.
I know that Outlook Express evolved from a newsreader of some sort and was
promoted as the free version of Outlook. However, back in the 1980s when
USENET was one of the few common, open, global bulletin board systems I
simply used the free version of Agent to access discussions and compile
binaries (since unix tn etc had interface challenges). That is why I am
still sensitive to the fact that USENET is independent of the Web. That
said, I am simply trying to come to the Microsoft website to get answers
for
what I think should be a relatively basic problem for their Microsoft Word
07. They are the ones who forwarded me to this Microsoft office online
discussion group system. I can still find no evidence of any other
'recent'
submissions on outlines, so I thank you for:
1. Responding and
2. Returning to this thread to respond.
If you don't like my inability to find other threads, then you should take
it up with Microsoft.

Click on the Multilevel list button and then on the illustration that
shows
1, 1.1, 1.1.1 linked to Heading 1, Heading 2, Heading 3, etc. *Then*
click
Define New Multilevel List, which will open the dialog with that list
template selected. From there, the Define New Multilevel List dialog is
more
or less identical to the Customize Outline-Numbered List dialog in Word
2003, although arranged a little differently. Click More to expand the
dialog, and you will see that the levels are linked to the built-in
heading
styles by default.

This did not work.

The multilevel list dialogue seems to be associated with normal textual
work
and not outlines. Moving elements around with the whole window open
immediately broke any connection that a 1/1.1/1.1.1/ numbering system
might
have with an outline. Shifting to the outline view ribbon tab revealed
that
once again Word seem to be creating a multilevel list as opposed to a
multilevel outline, with things working out of body text. No ability to
expand or contract sub elements.

And of course in the outline view one cannot see which headings one is
using
ahead of time, unless I guess one customizes the ribbon in some way. Is
that
what I need to tell college students to do? I am still not sure why
creation
of an numbering scheme for the outline would not be on the outline part of
the ribbon.

Returning to the general home ribbon: multilevel list / list and current
document is 1/1.1/1.1.1... / define a new multilevel list.. and the
expanded
dialogue reveals
apply changes to - the whole list,
link level to style - no style,
level to show in gallery - level I,
ListNum field list name - nothing
And down below their various alignment issues and ways to link one level
to
the other as you change which level to modify.

If I am in the ordinary print view, there is no sort of indentation that
one
might associate with an outline. And if you shift to outline view, all the
connections appear broken. For example, if I use the right arrow to shift
to
level III, there is no numbering scheme at all, no 1.1.1. Just text,
although with a plus or minus in a gray circle to indicate that I'm using
outline elements.

In the outline view, if I right-click on something that is at "level III"
the resulting dialogue suggests that there is no numbering scheme, and the
only thing that I am allowed to put in is a number or letter, nothing to
do
with a multilevel scheme anymore. And if I go back to the home ribbon,
multilevel list, it still says that I am using 1/1.1/1.1.1... numbering
scheme, but the none is now highlighted.

This is not like Word 2003. This is very different. Thanks.


--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...
Well, I am glad my post finally made it to the list. Perhaps the
repeated
non-sends had to do with the way I was closing my submissions (this
time I
used 'close' inside of Internet Explorer, rather than just 'post').
And
yes,
I can now see that the USENET Vehicle for
microsoft.public.word.docmanagement. That is not clear from the
official
Microsoft website that brought me here.

I hope it is clear that I want to create a "multilevel outline" and
*not*
a
"multilevel list". Period.

Yes, I can see the multilevel *list* tab with such options as, 'define
new
list style' and 'define new multilevel list.' However, no matter what
indent
or numbering scheme is used and meant to show up in the print layout,
every
line in the list is set as "body text". This fact (appears to) offer
no
functionality to *expand* or *collapse* sub-elements.

Whil to add this functionality, eone must invest a serious amount of
time
on resetting the 'heading sty'es.' I am making some headway on
programming
each 'heading style', I still don't see the way to link level, so that
one
would get:
1.
1.1
1.2
1.2.1
2.

One can go to the strip/home/styles/heading 1/[right-click]/modify
style/format tab/numbering and bullets/define new number format... but
there
no longer seems to be a link between levels as there was in Word 2003
when
you try to redefine 'Heading 2'

Again, I think it is a mistake that when I search on "multi-level
outline"
on the official Microsoft Office website I am sent to Multilevel list."
Shauna Kelly's tutorial does not appear to be updated for 2007 despite
what
it says at the bottom.

I think a single clear explanation of how to create ewould prove useful


.

Still no luck.

Thanks for the reply. Again, my goal: to create a multi-level outline as
opposed to a multi-level list, with a coherent numbering scheme. I am hoping
for a clear enough explanation so that I might teach college students how to
do it, and they could feel comfortable using their own multi-level of
outlines.

Now, if one searches on the Internet 'Word 2007 multilevel outline' one will
come up with documents like these, which I consulted before ever seeking to
bother re-asking something already solved:

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/wo...650171033.aspx - 'Create a
multilevel list' [not multilevel outline]
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numb...Numbering.html - 'Focused
on Word 2003 and earlier.'

So yes I have tried to work through the Shauna Kelly suggestions, which of
course may have contributed to problems. More on this in a moment. So as I
have said, I am working to create a multilevel outline not a multilevel list
so that 1.) expand or hide lower-level elements, and 2.) greater control
over the formatting of each level. Now, no sooner do I select some
multi-level list format, then it immediately breaks/disappears in either the
print view or the outline view. Yes, I am working with the 'define new
multilevel list' values, but what should the baseline values look like, and
what should the simplest 'heading values' look like?

One point of concern *I* have is that my settings for 'link level to style:'
at each level reads: '(no style)'. I don't remember changing anything, but
maybe that is a problem. A general FAQ for all users would help. If I begin
changing all of these values, and the outline still fail to create a
numbering system, then having a list of the original values would be ideal.

Possible solutions.
1. Create a FAQ listing the ideal, basic, plain values for the expanded
"define new multilevel list" dialogue - what should the "link level to style"
"listnum field list name" etc., values be set to? As factory setting-ish as
possible!

2. Create a FAQ listing the ideal baseline values for the 9 heading styles.
For example, my 'Heading 2' reads, "Level 2, Style: Linked, Hide until used,
Quick Style, Priority: 10, Based on: Heading 1, Following style: Normal."
Working with the document suggestions of Shawna Kelly, MVP, listed above, I
may have improperly altered the heading styles default values. As there is
no "return to factory settings" button (so far as I know), a list of the
simplest values would be useful. It should be clear from the values listed
here that I want my base outline Heading values to have no special
formatting: no bold, no blue fonts, no varied font size, no italics, and so
forth. Ideally, in the future I might want a way to invoke different outline
styles, so for one style 'Heading 2' would use a blue font and for another
style 'Heading 2" would use a green font. But that is an elaboration.

3. Put these default value FAQs on a shared visible space. The Word 2007
homepage http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/wo...649251033.aspx and
help-pages tell you from their perspective how to do things, but not how to
undue them. [and this is the web page that returns the 'create a multilevel
list' page noted above to the question of how to 'create a multi-level
outline.'

Ps. I found a copy of "MS Windows Mail 6.0.6" on my Vista64 machine which in
turn provided some access to
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsof...word.numbering which in turn
provided access to 'multilevel lists lose link styles' of 11/20/2009 which in
turn leads to questions of properly linking the list to the headings. Still
I am going to respond to this question via MS's own website, even though it
now appears that if I get the HTTP 408 Request Timeout or HTTP 409 Conflict,
then their Site in fact has not sent the message. Then I alt=right arrow back
a window, wait, and try to resent it till I get the 'close window' msg. I
haven't been able figure out how to send windows mail to a particular
newsgroup (i.e. microsoft.public.word.docmanagement).

I think you're still not getting it; you create outlines by using styles.
You number those styles using multilevel list numbering.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

"Geodesic" wrote in message
...
Still no luck.

Thanks for the reply. Again, my goal: to create a multi-level outline as
opposed to a multi-level list, with a coherent numbering scheme. I am
hoping
for a clear enough explanation so that I might teach college students how
to
do it, and they could feel comfortable using their own multi-level of
outlines.

Now, if one searches on the Internet 'Word 2007 multilevel outline' one
will
come up with documents like these, which I consulted before ever seeking
to
bother re-asking something already solved:

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/wo...650171033.aspx - 'Create a
multilevel list' [not multilevel outline]
http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/numb...Numbering.html - 'Focused
on Word 2003 and earlier.'

So yes I have tried to work through the Shauna Kelly suggestions, which of
course may have contributed to problems. More on this in a moment. So as
I
have said, I am working to create a multilevel outline not a multilevel
list
so that 1.) expand or hide lower-level elements, and 2.) greater control
over the formatting of each level. Now, no sooner do I select some
multi-level list format, then it immediately breaks/disappears in either
the
print view or the outline view. Yes, I am working with the 'define new
multilevel list' values, but what should the baseline values look like,
and
what should the simplest 'heading values' look like?

One point of concern *I* have is that my settings for 'link level to
style:'
at each level reads: '(no style)'. I don't remember changing anything,
but
maybe that is a problem. A general FAQ for all users would help. If I
begin
changing all of these values, and the outline still fail to create a
numbering system, then having a list of the original values would be
ideal.

Possible solutions.
1. Create a FAQ listing the ideal, basic, plain values for the expanded
"define new multilevel list" dialogue - what should the "link level to
style"
"listnum field list name" etc., values be set to? As factory setting-ish
as
possible!

2. Create a FAQ listing the ideal baseline values for the 9 heading
styles.
For example, my 'Heading 2' reads, "Level 2, Style: Linked, Hide until
used,
Quick Style, Priority: 10, Based on: Heading 1, Following style: Normal."
Working with the document suggestions of Shawna Kelly, MVP, listed above,
I
may have improperly altered the heading styles default values. As there
is
no "return to factory settings" button (so far as I know), a list of the
simplest values would be useful. It should be clear from the values
listed
here that I want my base outline Heading values to have no special
formatting: no bold, no blue fonts, no varied font size, no italics, and
so
forth. Ideally, in the future I might want a way to invoke different
outline
styles, so for one style 'Heading 2' would use a blue font and for another
style 'Heading 2" would use a green font. But that is an elaboration.

3. Put these default value FAQs on a shared visible space. The Word 2007
homepage http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/wo...649251033.aspx and
help-pages tell you from their perspective how to do things, but not how
to
undue them. [and this is the web page that returns the 'create a
multilevel
list' page noted above to the question of how to 'create a multi-level
outline.'

Ps. I found a copy of "MS Windows Mail 6.0.6" on my Vista64 machine which
in
turn provided some access to
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsof...word.numbering which in
turn
provided access to 'multilevel lists lose link styles' of 11/20/2009 which
in
turn leads to questions of properly linking the list to the headings.
Still
I am going to respond to this question via MS's own website, even though
it
now appears that if I get the HTTP 408 Request Timeout or HTTP 409
Conflict,
then their Site in fact has not sent the message. Then I alt=right arrow
back
a window, wait, and try to resent it till I get the 'close window' msg. I
haven't been able figure out how to send windows mail to a particular
newsgroup (i.e. microsoft.public.word.docmanagement).

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:
I think you're still not getting it; you create outlines by using styles.
You number those styles using multilevel list numbering.

That may be, but I already drew attention to to how I had to use the article
by Shauna Kelly, MVP to change the styles of "Heading1", "Heading2", etc.
because of problems I was already having. That is why I sought to see if
there was a FAQ listing what either the ideal, or the original, or the
'usual' settings for Headings 1-9 might be, thinking that maybe the settings
were wrong, breaking a proper link between the outline and the styles.

Let's do this step by step. Suppose I open the outline view, shift back to
the home ribbon, and choose the 1/1.1/1.1.1 outline style from multilevel
list.

I go down to the first line of the document, and type something. I see the
number 1 appear; then I hit return, type something, and see the 2 appear on
the second line, and 3 on the third line. Very nice, so far.

Now I demote that third line to be a subset or child of the second line,
using the alt-shft-left arrow shortcut so that I can watch the following
occur... I see the style shift to 'heading2' on the ribbon... but instead of
a 2.1 prefix, the number 3 remains. If I demote it further, I can watch the
Heading2 shift to Heading3, but instead of getting something like 2.1.1, it
remains 3, and remains number #3 all the way up to Heading9. You might not
think I am watching the "styles" but it looks to me like I am.

Now I go back to the 'multilevel list' on the home ribbon, open it, and what
do I see highlighted as my current choice: you guessed it, 1, 1.1, 1.1.1...
as my numbering choice.

More evidence. I have the Heading3 set to 'bold' the text. Now as I demote
my element and its text, and I can watch the text go from not bold
(heading2/level2)... to bold (heading3/level3)... and back to 'not bold'
(heading4/level4) - again using the alt-shift-arrow shortcut. At no point
does the numbering change (except to become bold at heading3).

You might not think that I understand the link between numbering and styles,
but I still don't believe the link is working. That, of course, is why I
pointed out what the values were of a sample of my heading styles, and of the
'define new multilevel list'

What I asked in the last note was whether anyone knew what the default or
ideal settings for these headings might be. And I expressed in that post, I
hope that such settings could be noted in a FAQ somewhere, ideally on MS's
own site.