Table design question re duplicates fields

I am using Access 2007. I am trying to create a job searching database. The
problem I am having is the phone number field. Sometimes there may be six
different phone numbers. In all the examples I have looked at, they have all
separate fields—that is, Work Phone, Home Phone, Car Phone, and so on. Is
there a better way to set this up? Is there a way to save data from four
different fields into one field? I have the following fields:

PhoneType1 = Business
Phone1
PhoneType2 = Business 2
Phone2
PhoneType3 = Business Fax
Phone3
PhoneType4 = Mobile
Phone4

As you can see above that Phone type is repeated over and over again.

There should be no duplicates phone numbers for a company.

The phone numbers needs to be in one column in order to sort, filter, and
find.

Also, I want the four PhoneType fields to always be displayed on my form
until I decide to change the type it.

Any suggestions?

On Thu, 7 May 2009 10:37:01 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I am using Access 2007. I am trying to create a job searching database. The
problem I am having is the phone number field. Sometimes there may be six
different phone numbers. In all the examples I have looked at, they have all
separate fields—that is, Work Phone, Home Phone, Car Phone, and so on. Is
there a better way to set this up? Is there a way to save data from four
different fields into one field? I have the following fields:

PhoneType1 = Business
Phone1
PhoneType2 = Business 2
Phone2
PhoneType3 = Business Fax
Phone3
PhoneType4 = Mobile
Phone4

As you can see above that Phone type is repeated over and over again.

There should be no duplicates phone numbers for a company.

The phone numbers needs to be in one column in order to sort, filter, and
find.

Also, I want the four PhoneType fields to always be displayed on my form
until I decide to change the type it.

Any suggestions?


You're using a relational database: use it relationally!

One Company has multiple Phones: a one to many relationship. Create a *second
table*, Phones, with fields

PhoneID: Autonumber primary key
CompanyID: foreign key to your current table's primary key
PhoneType: Text, "Business", "Home", etc. etc., probably from a very small one
field PhoneTypes table
Phone: Text, the actual phone number

You can create a unique two-field Index on CompanyID and Phone to prevent
duplicates.

I question whether you might need multiple Contacts (people with whom to
communicate) at each Company though, and have the phone table linked to
Contacts rather than to Companies.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

Yes, I did just that. Company and PhoneNumber are my primary keys.

The problem is I want my form to always display Business, Business 2,
Business Fax, and Mobile with all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber
field.

Contacts -- I am not sure about that because the people I contact are inside
the company--like, human resource manager, secretary, supervisor... And,
their addresses are usually the same except with very big companies like
Exxon, Shell...

"John W. Vinson" wrote:

On Thu, 7 May 2009 10:37:01 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I am using Access 2007. I am trying to create a job searching database. The
problem I am having is the phone number field. Sometimes there may be six
different phone numbers. In all the examples I have looked at, they have all
separate fields—that is, Work Phone, Home Phone, Car Phone, and so on. Is
there a better way to set this up? Is there a way to save data from four
different fields into one field? I have the following fields:

PhoneType1 = Business
Phone1
PhoneType2 = Business 2
Phone2
PhoneType3 = Business Fax
Phone3
PhoneType4 = Mobile
Phone4

As you can see above that Phone type is repeated over and over again.

There should be no duplicates phone numbers for a company.

The phone numbers needs to be in one column in order to sort, filter, and
find.

Also, I want the four PhoneType fields to always be displayed on my form
until I decide to change the type it.

Any suggestions?


You're using a relational database: use it relationally!

One Company has multiple Phones: a one to many relationship. Create a *second
table*, Phones, with fields

PhoneID: Autonumber primary key
CompanyID: foreign key to your current table's primary key
PhoneType: Text, "Business", "Home", etc. etc., probably from a very small one
field PhoneTypes table
Phone: Text, the actual phone number

You can create a unique two-field Index on CompanyID and Phone to prevent
duplicates.

I question whether you might need multiple Contacts (people with whom to
communicate) at each Company though, and have the phone table linked to
Contacts rather than to Companies.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

On Thu, 7 May 2009 16:09:01 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

Yes, I did just that. Company and PhoneNumber are my primary keys.

The problem is I want my form to always display Business, Business 2,
Business Fax, and Mobile with all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber
field.

I'm not sure I understand. You'ld use a Subform based on Phones on the form,
displaying the phone number and the phone type fields. What do you mean by
"all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber field"? There should only be
one.

Contacts -- I am not sure about that because the people I contact are inside
the company--like, human resource manager, secretary, supervisor... And,
their addresses are usually the same except with very big companies like
Exxon, Shell...

So? They might all have the same ADDRESS but surely they each have their own
phone. I have a set of tables

CONtblPeople
ContactID
LastName
FirstName
etc

CONtblAddresses
AddressID autonumber PK
ContactID
Address1
Direction
Street
Suffix ' e.g. St., Ave., Blvd.
City
State ' also used for Province, etc.
PostCode

CONtblPhones
PhoneID autonumber PK
ContactID
PhoneType
Phone

--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

The problem is I want my form to always display Business, Business 2,
Business Fax, and Mobile with all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber
field.

I'm not sure I understand. You'ld use a Subform based on Phones on the form,
displaying the phone number and the phone type fields. What do you mean by
"all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber field"? There should only be
one.

I want my form to look like Outlook Contact Manager form. You know:

Phone Numbers
Business 800-833-1212
Business 2
Business Fax 800-833-1213
Mobile

Using the subform it will only display if there is data and if no data it
will not display Business, Business 2...

I am reading Access Basics for Programming by Crystal I got off of Allen
Browne's website. I haven't finished yet but maybe it will be address here.

Thanks!


"John W. Vinson" wrote:

On Thu, 7 May 2009 16:09:01 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

Yes, I did just that. Company and PhoneNumber are my primary keys.

The problem is I want my form to always display Business, Business 2,
Business Fax, and Mobile with all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber
field.

I'm not sure I understand. You'ld use a Subform based on Phones on the form,
displaying the phone number and the phone type fields. What do you mean by
"all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber field"? There should only be
one.

Contacts -- I am not sure about that because the people I contact are inside
the company--like, human resource manager, secretary, supervisor... And,
their addresses are usually the same except with very big companies like
Exxon, Shell...

So? They might all have the same ADDRESS but surely they each have their own
phone. I have a set of tables

CONtblPeople
ContactID
LastName
FirstName
etc

CONtblAddresses
AddressID autonumber PK
ContactID
Address1
Direction
Street
Suffix ' e.g. St., Ave., Blvd.
City
State ' also used for Province, etc.
PostCode

CONtblPhones
PhoneID autonumber PK
ContactID
PhoneType
Phone

--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

On Thu, 7 May 2009 18:02:06 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I'm not sure I understand. You'ld use a Subform based on Phones on the form,
displaying the phone number and the phone type fields. What do you mean by
"all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber field"? There should only be
one.

I want my form to look like Outlook Contact Manager form. You know:

Phone Numbers
Business 800-833-1212
Business 2
Business Fax 800-833-1213
Mobile

Using the subform it will only display if there is data and if no data it
will not display Business, Business 2...

Ah, ok.

Base the subform not on Phones but on a Query left joining PhoneTypes to
Phones:

SELECT PhoneTypes.PhoneType, Phones.PhoneType, Phones.Phones
FROM PhoneTypes LEFT JOIN Phones
ON PhoneTypes.PhoneType = Phones.PhoneType
ORDER BY PhoneTypes.PhoneType;

This will display all types whether or not there's a phone to match. You do
need to include the PhoneType field from both tables in order to have the
query updateable, but you needn't display it in the subform.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

I could not get the query to work. And, I sort of didn’t understand it. I
need it to be very basic.

Anyway, after trying it so many times I messed up the database, so I started
over with a new database and created two tables this time.

tblCompanies

CompanyID AutoNumber
CompanyName Text


tblPhoneNumbers

PhoneNumberID Autonumber
Business Text
Business2 Text
BusinessFax Text
Mobile Text
CompanyID Number

If I did it this way, will I be able to sort, filter, and find the phone
numbers without having to search each field? I know this way I will not be
able to add additional phone numbers unless I add more fields, which was what
I was trying not to do.

I wish there was a way to upload the db or post a picture of it.




"John W. Vinson" wrote:

On Thu, 7 May 2009 18:02:06 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I'm not sure I understand. You'ld use a Subform based on Phones on the form,
displaying the phone number and the phone type fields. What do you mean by
"all the values being stored in the PhoneNumber field"? There should only be
one.

I want my form to look like Outlook Contact Manager form. You know:

Phone Numbers
Business 800-833-1212
Business 2
Business Fax 800-833-1213
Mobile

Using the subform it will only display if there is data and if no data it
will not display Business, Business 2...

Ah, ok.

Base the subform not on Phones but on a Query left joining PhoneTypes to
Phones:

SELECT PhoneTypes.PhoneType, Phones.PhoneType, Phones.Phones
FROM PhoneTypes LEFT JOIN Phones
ON PhoneTypes.PhoneType = Phones.PhoneType
ORDER BY PhoneTypes.PhoneType;

This will display all types whether or not there's a phone to match. You do
need to include the PhoneType field from both tables in order to have the
query updateable, but you needn't display it in the subform.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

On Thu, 7 May 2009 19:41:05 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I could not get the query to work. And, I sort of didn’t understand it. I
need it to be very basic.

Anyway, after trying it so many times I messed up the database, so I started
over with a new database and created two tables this time.

tblCompanies

CompanyID AutoNumber
CompanyName Text


tblPhoneNumbers

PhoneNumberID Autonumber
Business Text
Business2 Text
BusinessFax Text
Mobile Text
CompanyID Number

If I did it this way, will I be able to sort, filter, and find the phone
numbers without having to search each field? I know this way I will not be
able to add additional phone numbers unless I add more fields, which was what
I was trying not to do.

You're still making the same mistake.

Fields are expensive... records are cheap.

Your tblPhoneNumbers should not have one field for each phone number; it
should have ONE RECORD for each phone number.

Try two tables:

tblPhoneTypes
PhoneType (Text, Primary Key)
Seq (Number)

Fill it with the various phone types you want, with Seq containing a number
which will define the sort order.

tblPhoneNumbers
PhoneNumberID Autonumber Primary Key
CompanyID Number (joined to Companies in the relationship window)
PhoneType Text (joined to tblPhoneTypes in the relationship window)
Phone

Create a unique two field index on CompanyID and Phone.

If someone has three phones, they would have three records in tblPhoneNumbers.
If they have only one phone they would have only one record.

Create a new Query. Don't pick any tables; instead copy and paste the
following SQL into the SQL window:

SELECT tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType, tblPhoneNumbers.PhoneType,
tblPhoneNumbers.Phone, tblPhoneNumbers.CompanyID
FROM tblPhoneTypes LEFT JOIN tblPhoneNumbers
ON tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType = tblPhoneNumbers.PhoneType
ORDER BY tblPhoneTypes.Seq;

Save this query, and use it as the recordsource for a Subform on your company
form, using CompanyID as the master/child link field. Make it a continuous
form; put textboxes for tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType but set it to Enabled = No,
Locked = Yes so users can't change your master phone type table. Put another
textbox for Phone.

You'll see as many rows as there are phone types; if there's a Mobile phone
for the company, you'll see that phone number in the phone field. If you type
in a new phone number next to the Business 1 phone type, Access will copy the
PhoneType value from tblPhoneTypes to that record in tblPhoneNumbers,
maintaining the link.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

Hi John,

I followed your instructions but the form doesn’t display the Business,
Business 2, Business Fax, and Mobile. If there is no phone number for one of
these fields, it leaves the phone type blank. I tried it again and track
each step. They are as follows:

1. Created main form with one field: CompanyName

2. Saved as frmCompanies

3. Created subform by using the Control Wizard.

4. Used existing Tables and Queries.

5. Next

6. Query: Query1

7. Available fields choices: tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType
Phone
CompanyID

8. Next

9. Choose from a list: Show Query1 for each record in tblCompanies using
CompanyID

10. Next

11. What name would you like for your subform? Query1 subform

12. Finish

13. Open Property Sheet to look at Query1 subform

14. Under Data tab

Source Object: Query1 subform
Link MasterField CompanyID
Link Child Field CompanyID

15. Close Form

16. Opened Query1 subform

17. Property Sheet

Default view = Continuous Forms

18. First Text Box = tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType

19. Went to Data tab

Control Source = tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType
Enable = No
Locked = Yes

20. Second Text Box = Phone

21. Close

22. Opened frmCompanies

23. Query1 subform displays a text box, which is blank because I haven’t
entered a
phone number for this company.

24. Went to second record where there is a phone number for company, so here
two text boxes are displayed. One with the number and the
other one is
empty. For example:

Business 832-888-1919
____________

25. The PhoneType text boxes do not display Business, Business 2, Business
Fax,
Mobile.

Where did I go wrong?

I am glad you understand what I am trying to do, but maybe I missed a step
or something. What do you think?

Thanks a bunch!!!



"John W. Vinson" wrote:

On Thu, 7 May 2009 19:41:05 -0700, lmcc007
wrote:

I could not get the query to work. And, I sort of didn’t understand it. I
need it to be very basic.

Anyway, after trying it so many times I messed up the database, so I started
over with a new database and created two tables this time.

tblCompanies

CompanyID AutoNumber
CompanyName Text


tblPhoneNumbers

PhoneNumberID Autonumber
Business Text
Business2 Text
BusinessFax Text
Mobile Text
CompanyID Number

If I did it this way, will I be able to sort, filter, and find the phone
numbers without having to search each field? I know this way I will not be
able to add additional phone numbers unless I add more fields, which was what
I was trying not to do.

You're still making the same mistake.

Fields are expensive... records are cheap.

Your tblPhoneNumbers should not have one field for each phone number; it
should have ONE RECORD for each phone number.

Try two tables:

tblPhoneTypes
PhoneType (Text, Primary Key)
Seq (Number)

Fill it with the various phone types you want, with Seq containing a number
which will define the sort order.

tblPhoneNumbers
PhoneNumberID Autonumber Primary Key
CompanyID Number (joined to Companies in the relationship window)
PhoneType Text (joined to tblPhoneTypes in the relationship window)
Phone

Create a unique two field index on CompanyID and Phone.

If someone has three phones, they would have three records in tblPhoneNumbers.
If they have only one phone they would have only one record.

Create a new Query. Don't pick any tables; instead copy and paste the
following SQL into the SQL window:

SELECT tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType, tblPhoneNumbers.PhoneType,
tblPhoneNumbers.Phone, tblPhoneNumbers.CompanyID
FROM tblPhoneTypes LEFT JOIN tblPhoneNumbers
ON tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType = tblPhoneNumbers.PhoneType
ORDER BY tblPhoneTypes.Seq;

Save this query, and use it as the recordsource for a Subform on your company
form, using CompanyID as the master/child link field. Make it a continuous
form; put textboxes for tblPhoneTypes.PhoneType but set it to Enabled = No,
Locked = Yes so users can't change your master phone type table. Put another
textbox for Phone.

You'll see as many rows as there are phone types; if there's a Mobile phone
for the company, you'll see that phone number in the phone field. If you type
in a new phone number next to the Business 1 phone type, Access will copy the
PhoneType value from tblPhoneTypes to that record in tblPhoneNumbers,
maintaining the link.
--

John W. Vinson [MVP]

If you haven't entered additional phone numbers (with their phone types) for
that company, nothing should be displayed. It occurred to me that you
might be expecting to see those other ones as "blanks" with the phone type
listed and a blank place for the phone number (like you did in your previous
structure)